How Meera Hardin Found Her True Path to Joy

Aransas Savas (: 00:01

Welcome to the Uplifters podcast. I'm your host, Aransas Savas. And today I am joined by Meera Hardin. And Meera was nominated just now by Sara Axelbaum, who you met in a previous episode. And when I asked Sara who the most inspiring woman she knew was, she said Meera. And so I couldn't wait to meet Meera and introduce her to all of you. So Meera.

Meera (: 00:23

Huh.

Aransas Savas (: 00:30

is the host of the Brown Girl Trending podcast, which focuses on career, women's success. She's also the host of the Daily podcast, Woke and Pretty. My mind is just scrambled thinking about how one does a daily podcast, which focuses on life, celeb gossip, advice, fun. Basically, she's just hanging out with Mira every day, which signed me up. She is also a trailblazing figure in the media industry. but she's not just a worker. She's not just a doer, she's a person with a real journey and a life. And her work really is a testament to her unwavering determination and resilience. She arrived in the US as an immigrant. She fought her way to the top despite career setbacks.

And her journey is a reminder to all of us that with a deep sense of purpose and a deep sense of impact, we can keep going no matter what comes our way. I am so glad to have you here with us today, Mira. Welcome.

Meera (: 01:47

Thank you so much for having me, I'm honored.

Aransas Savas (: 01:50

So I want to hear about your career, but you know me, I got to start with the personal piece of it. Indeed, tell us about this journey of coming to America as an immigrant with your family and what that's meant for your identity.

Meera (: 01:56

Oh, of course. That's the juicy bit.

Meera (: 02:10

So I have to say, I didn't really think of that as part of my identity until the last few years, which is crazy, but.

Aransas Savas (: 02:20

It isn't though, because that is exactly, as children we accept whatever we have, we don't question it.

Meera (: 02:26

Yeah, I guess it just was. And I grew up in Brooklyn, and a lot of people around me, they were either American or not, and they were also immigrants. So it was just a very diverse area that we grew up in. And I think the way I got here, at the time, my mom and my dad, there was four of us, and we got split up. So my sister and I ended up coming to the US, living with my grandparents. And we basically had to leave.

Aransas Savas (: 02:28

Yeah.

Meera (: 02:56

everything behind and live with somebody that I've only met once. And me being the quiet person that I was back then just kind of accepted it. I was eight years old and my sister was the exact opposite. So she was kind of the reactionary, I don't want to say angry, but just always fighting back type of person. And I learned really early on to adapt because she wasn't adapting well. So I had to be that good person. And I think

I didn't realize that until recently because I felt like I had to prove something. I had to prove that this was an opportunity, it was a sacrifice, and I have always been the type of person that want to be successful. And even at a young age, I would go to school early and do extra classes, and I would do the more advanced classes. I had to finish in the top of my class at the end of school, and then I had to...

I was like, I want to go to college, but I can't pay for it, so I need to get a scholarship. So I sacrificed my entire senior year so I can apply and interview and just get school paid for. And I did all those things. I interned in high school at all these major fashion companies. I did extracurricular. I did everything possible. And I think I never stopped to reflect that there were other things that I could have done outside of working to be successful.

And unfortunately, it kind of spiraled because my entire 20s and 30s, I did the same thing. And then horribly, but thankfully, the pandemic happened. I had a baby right before the pandemic. And I know everyone says that it changes your life, but that with the pandemic, oh my God, it made me stop. Like I had to stop, yeah.

Aransas Savas (: 04:41

Wow. What did you learn about yourself through that?

Meera (: 04:48

I learned working from home was awesome for me. I mean, yeah, I learned working from home for people that are not awesome was not worth my time. And I also learned that I was grateful to have a baby and spend the time with him because at the end of the day, I was fully ready to travel an hour and a half back into the city and an hour and a half back home.

Aransas Savas (: 04:53

Same.

Aransas Savas (: 05:00

Mm-hmm.

Meera (: 05:16

put him in daycare for extended hours and basically miss out because when you don't know what it's like to be a parent and you're just told that's what you do, you do it. And now I had this choice and I decided to choose him and me and my family and it literally changed my world. Yeah.

Aransas Savas (: 05:26

Mm-hmm.

Aransas Savas (: 05:39

And for somebody who had such an achiever tendency and who probably found a lot of recognition and personal satisfaction in being in charge and achieving new heights, what was it like to change those rules for yourself and say, I'm going to lean out a little bit? Or lean into something different is probably truer.

Meera (: 05:43

Mm-hmm.

Meera (: 06:02

Yeah, it was.

Do you know, I didn't even think about me doing it differently. All I thought about was I need to, I guess I should preface this by saying my husband is a doctor. And during the pandemic, he was on the front lines, right? So he was in and out of the hospital. And I had, I'm very emotional about this, I had a newborn baby. And so I was seeing both sides. And so for me to sit at my job and deal with the things that I didn't need to deal with, it wasn't worth my time.

I ended up changing jobs and doing something that required less effort on my part, making money and doing all the things and it just didn't make me happy. And so I had to sit back and realize I wasn't getting fulfilled and my cup wasn't getting filled by doing these things that I thought I was supposed to do. And taking a step back from my client relationships, the people that I knew in my industry, the trajectory that I was on.

was very hard. I had to basically put myself first with the support of my husband, of course, knowing that I would be judged on the outside, that I'm taking this break, maybe it's burnout, maybe it's stepping back, what is she doing? And then I felt like I had to have something else that I needed to achieve, which was my personal business and my success. And I started to go down a path where I was doing things that I didn't like again. And it wasn't

Aransas Savas (: 07:09

Yeah.

Aransas Savas (: 07:19

Mm-hmm.

Meera (: 07:37

trying to make money in a way that I didn't like, that I was like, what was all of this for? And that's when it really changed for me. I didn't come all the way here, give myself all these opportunities, have my family sacrifice for me to do what they think I'm supposed to be doing and still not be happy. That doesn't make sense. I-

Aransas Savas (: 07:40

Mm.

Aransas Savas (: 07:45

I didn't come all the way here to give myself.

Aransas Savas (: 08:00

Mm-hmm.

Meera (: 08:03

This wasn't for me, and so I had to figure it out. And I would say probably after about eight months to 10 months of just trying to figure it out, I was at a loss, and I had to come to peace with that being okay, because what really mattered was the work wouldn't matter, the money doesn't matter. My health matters, my kid matters, my husband matters. Do I have a roof over my head? Am I paying for the basic things? I'm happy.

And that was really humbling. It was really humbling.

Aransas Savas (: 08:33

Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. I think of that as coming back to center. And so often, I think we are pulled towards a point somewhere off in the distance that is romanticized and fetishized for us and painted as this ideal. And so naturally, we move toward that because it sounds really great.

Meera (: 08:56

Worst. Yeah, it makes sense.

Aransas Savas (: 09:00

And we don't know really what it's gonna be like, so you might as well keep going. But I think that moment that you had, and it's one I've had as well, is so clarifying, because it is this moment of, wait, what am I working toward if this is my life and I don't feel good in it?

Meera (: 09:04

Mm-hmm.

Meera (: 09:22

Yeah, I mean, it's this radical idea that we have to put ourselves first, nurture ourselves and find out what it is that makes us fulfilled. It's radical because people think they know it and they're like, well, I need to be leading a team. I need to be the CEO of this company. But my question is, and I say this all the time, when does it stop?

Aransas Savas (: 09:37

Mm-hmm.

Aransas Savas (: 09:43

Mm-hmm.

Meera (: 09:49

When does that marker stop? And you're like, I've reached that top. I've reached the top of my mountain and now I can lay back and enjoy life. You don't reach that. You know, when people normally try to reach that retirement, when they're like, now I'm going to do all the things that I wanted to do, but you just had all these years to do these things and that wasn't working for me anymore. And I have to say that was so hard, but thank God it happened. Thank God I got to that realization.

Aransas Savas (: 09:50

Mmm.

Aransas Savas (: 09:59

Mm-mm.

Aransas Savas (: 10:03

Mm-hmm.

Meera (: 10:18

because now I look at my life very differently. I'm at a really nice age where I think I can have maybe, hopefully another exactly amount of years, God willing, and I'm gonna live the rest of my X amount of decades differently. I spent the first 40 something years of my life doing what I was supposed to do, doing what the societal norms were, doing what...

Aransas Savas (: 10:41

Mm-hmm.

Meera (: 10:44

Everyone in my family think I'm successful, and then all of a sudden I wasn't. And I'm okay with that because my measure of success is not the money and the title in working for these great companies. The measure of success for me is how I feel about myself. Am I giving back to the world? What's the impact that I left behind for the world, for my son? Is he a kind human being? Is he speaking up for himself? Is he treating women the way they're supposed to be treated? That is important to me.

because I have experienced a lot of things. So those are the things that's gonna matter to me on my deathbed when I think back to was I successful? Not running a company.

Aransas Savas (: 11:15

Mm.

Aransas Savas (: 11:25

And I mean, I relate to every word of this, and it's so meaningful to me personally to hear this story. But I also can imagine all of the uplifters out there listening to this story with their eyes wide open. And that reinforcement that this beautiful, bold, joyful life that we dream of is possible, right? And I think we...

We, it's vital that we have stories like yours out in the world so that we can all remember that more and better is available. That said, for 40 plus years, you were trained to respond one way. You were trained to keep rising. So that's going to be a shiny object that keeps coming back for you, no doubt. How do you keep pulling yourself back to center?

Meera (: 12:16

Mm-hmm.

Meera (: 12:22

So I will say the year and a half that I quote unquote took off, right, slash, I still did work and I still did things, like I said, but the year and a half that I took for myself has me at this place now where it's almost like fate intervened and I connected with people I've never met.

received a job offer that I never expected to receive that's within my wheelhouse with my experience, but with really amazing people that are honest and understanding and supportive. And with that came a higher title, the potential for more. It just kind of fell into place. And I don't feel like I'm doing what I have to do. I feel like I'm just supposed to be here and I'm gonna do it the way I wanna do it.

while I prioritize my family and while I prioritize all these other things that's making me happy. And they're so supportive of it. And I didn't think this existed. And I would not have went back to work if I didn't work for a company or people like this.

It was a gut feeling almost instantaneously. And they, the CEO of the company I work for, he's a wonderful guy. He felt the same way. And the fact that he was so honest about it. And I said to him, you know, my priority in the past year and a half has been X, Y, and Z. And he's like, I love it. I love everything that you've done.

And then he was like, when can you start? And I said, well, not Monday, because it's a holiday. And he goes, oh, is it? Absolutely not. Kids come first. And so I'm like, thank you. But the fact that those little things meant so much to me, a mom, a woman, it's crazy that what we accept from other companies. I mean, there's these TikToks going around with companies who are like,

supportive of the pandemic working from home, then, oh, it's never gonna go back, but now we expect you back, thank you, because we said so. And there's this man, I forget his name, he's an economist in Europe, and he's basically saying that the unemployment rate is to put that pressure on the employees to know that jobs are sparse. So get back into that employee mindset because people are thinking that they have a choice and they're interviewing companies and it shouldn't be that way. And it really bothered me.

Aransas Savas (: 14:49

Yep.

Meera (: 14:57

And he's not, but he's not wrong. Right, but he's not wrong. We need to be like that for this economy to work the way that they want it. But I challenge, I mean, why are we on this earth? What are we doing here to work? And no offense to anything that I do and all the employers that I've had before, I sell media for a living. Is that really gonna change the world? Am I really, is people gonna cry? Oh, I don't see any more commercials on TV. No, they're not gonna cry about that.

Aransas Savas (: 14:57

It's a push to a scarcity mindset. You should take what you can get. Yeah.

Meera (: 15:27

Um, so what I was doing wasn't exactly saving lives, right? So it wasn't really to me worth it. So if I'm going to continue to do something within that arena, it's going to be for people that I care about, people that care about me. And care about the fact that they know they're not my number and priority, my family is. It's simple, right? Simple.

Aransas Savas (: 15:33

No.

Aransas Savas (: 15:47

Yes, yes. Well, and I think if we take from your story a filter for how we cultivate that in our lives, and it is fascinating, Mira, how parallel our journeys have been over the last three years. I mean, fascinating because I now work for a company of just really nice, kind people who really genuinely put family first and who really genuinely do work that is

Meera (: 16:01

Ooh.

Meera (: 16:08

Ooh.

Aransas Savas (: 16:18

doing work that has lots of big impact, but is also a good fit with my life. I mean, it's just, it's fascinating. But to me, there was a filter that you shared in there that I think we can all apply. And it's, again, it's counterintuitive to everything we were ever trained to do, which is to make ourselves look good and to fit into a mold so that we, as human beings, can be purchased as a good.

Meera (: 16:23

Right.

Meera (: 16:47

Mm-hmm.

Aransas Savas (: 16:48

And that is what the employee-employment relationship is, right? But I think what you said is I led with truth. I said these are my needs. This is what I'm willing to give you. I'm willing to do a great job for you, but it has to work with my life. And in return, you opened up space for your employer to be truthful with you and to come to an honest agreement. And I think we...

all carry the blame for the lack of integrity in our work lives. Because so much of the way we approach it is without integrity on all sides. Yes, we're told that's the only way. And then we hear a story like yours and we're like, Oh, what would happen if I were truthful?

Meera (: 17:23

Right? Well, we're taught that way.

Meera (: 17:33

You know, right, but it's a scary thought. If someone's listening out there and they hear my story, then they hear your story, they think, oh, they're lucky. That like, oh my God, it's never gonna happen to me. And the thing is, we took a risk. I took a risk by putting myself first. Like I said earlier, it's a radical thought because people, when they think put myself first, I'm getting a massage, I'm getting the, no, no. It's different. Putting yourself first is not only your mental state,

Aransas Savas (: 17:43

Mm-hmm.

Aransas Savas (: 17:53

Hmm.

Meera (: 18:02

but really centering yourself like you said, and understanding what's gonna fill you up and what's gonna make you feel like you're making an impact and how are you serving the people you care about? And how are you gonna feel about yourself when you leave this earth? You know, if you believe in manifestation, if you believe in the law of attractive, what is it called, the law of attraction?

Aransas Savas (: 18:12

Mm-hmm.

Aransas Savas (: 18:18

Mm-hmm.

Aransas Savas (: 18:28

Law of Attraction. Yeah.

Meera (: 18:30

Maybe that's what it is because it happened to both of us, but I really, it was the most random thing and I'm stinkingly happy with how it turned out, but it wouldn't have happened if I didn't take that sacrifice and risk and not listen to anyone's opinions and not try to fulfill the norms and go against the grain of what I've been taught is success.

Aransas Savas (: 18:32

Mm-hmm.

Aransas Savas (: 18:55

Well, and I think, again, I'm just going to keep calling it truth because I think it's so much about us telling our true stories. And I shared, hey, I've been laid off. Hey, I'm doing this. Hey, I'd like more of this and less of that. And every time I said this, I got clearer about what I needed. But I also helped other people understand where I could be helpful and valuable to them. And I hear the same in your story.

Meera (: 19:02

Yeah.

Aransas Savas (: 19:23

It is that communication that creates the necessary information to allow us to manifest or attract or whatever we want to call it. It comes down to telling the true story.

Um, you're so right about that. And it's crazy because all of the things that I found out about myself during this time, I never would have found out. I didn't know I wanted to do podcasts. I started doing my first podcast, Brown Girl Trending. And I was like, oh, I'm helping people. I'm saying what I need to say. And that's true. And then there was a distinctive.

Meera (: 20:10

where I'm like, I don't want to do this. This is work. But also I feel like it's forced. It stopped being fun and started being forced. And I had to recenter, find the truth about what I'm doing, make it fun again. AndI'm working with this podcast manager, and we just have such a good friendship now., it just happened so organically because I allowed that to come into my life. And then because we had such a good rapport, crazy, let's do our own podcast together. We're having so much fun. We don't need to do this once a week. Let's do it three times a week. Hey, let's make it daily. And we did within two months. It's a daily podcast, two months with someone I've never physically met. Yeah.

Aransas Savas (: 21:05

Oh my goodness.

Meera (: 21:07

And it's been such, it's such a joy to go back to having fun, but in a way that I never even knew existed. And I never would have known if I didn't take a chance on myself.

Aransas Savas (: 21:22

And again, we have to come back to how you did this as a translatable process, because you're right, there are people out there who are saying, this is impossible, this can't be for me. But what did you do? You started watching the breadcrumbs and you said, this feels good, this feels aligned with my happiness. I'll say yes to more of that. This doesn't, I'll say no to that. And so it is, it's just yeses and nos around that single question.

Meera (: 21:51

I followed my gut. I followed what I felt was right, and I didn't have to have a reason. And I knew what was wrong intuitively. I mean, we forget that we have that because we trump it down so much. And when you actually start leaning into it, you realize it comes hard and fast. And it was surprising to me, like this particular job, it was almost immediate where I was like, yes.

Aransas Savas (: 21:53

Uh huh.

Uh huh. Yeah.

Yeah.

Mm-hmm.

Meera (: 22:18

my new friend, she even said, I never thought I would do this. And as soon as you sent me that email that we should work together, she was like, immediately I felt it all around me that it had to have been a yes. And I've never been in spaces where these things are talked about. I mean, this crazy talk, right? And it never would have happened. Here's my first step of what I did. And you said it actually earlier too. You put yourself and your thoughts out there. I posted my very first post.

Aransas Savas (: 22:43

Mm-hmm.

Meera (: 22:46

under at Mira Hardin on my Instagram, petrified. Literally I posted like a blurb about myself and I was so scared and I felt like the dread inside of me. And after it was posted, I felt that. And I also felt relief. And then I started seeing people comment, like, whatever. And what was I afraid of? What?

Aransas Savas (: 23:10

What were you afraid of? I know it was your truth. And yet, girl, do I understand that feeling? It is so, even with people I trust, it's scary and hard. But we get more tuned into our guts with practice, to your point, and that becomes like an intimate communication. We also, though, get more comfortable with honesty the more we practice it.

Meera (: 23:23

Mm-hmm.

Meera (: 23:28

Mm-hmm.

Meera (: 23:33

Yeah.

Meera (: 23:38

Yeah, you're right. You're absolutely right. I mean, I never thought I was dishonest, but I think the honesty with myself versus me telling myself what I think I'm supposed to tell myself, there's a difference. But yeah, that whole pulling the rug from under myself and putting myself on social media, I guess I was afraid of judgment, maybe. I guess I was afraid of people knowing what I thought was a scary truth.

Aransas Savas (: 23:54

Mm-hmm, mm-hmm, mm-hmm.

Aransas Savas (: 24:06

Yeah.

Meera (: 24:07

I don't know, but to this day, I'm gonna be grateful that I did that because if I didn't do that, I would never have went on this journey. And if you asked me, and even in 2021, if you asked me where I'd be right now in 2023, two years later, it would not be here being interviewed on your podcast while I had two podcasts of my own, plus leading a division of a company, plus doing all these other things that are bringing me joy. But thank God for that.

Aransas Savas (: 24:34

And none of it could have happened. Thank goodness for that. And again, it goes back to this difference between a scarcity mindset and an abundance mindset. And I think you're right. So much of the messaging we get is like, there isn't enough. It's not going to be okay.

Meera (: 24:36

and goodness for that.

Mm-hmm.

Meera (: 24:45

Yes.

Meera (: 26:07

Listen, if I continued the way I was going, I would have been perfectly fine. I would have probably worked, still have my son, been there for him, I probably would have figured it out. But would I be talking to you with a smile? Would I be saying, I tried all these cool things? Probably not. I would have continued on the trajectory that I was on.

Aransas Savas (: 26:48

in that safe place that was familiar. Yeah.

Meera (: 26:50

completely safe and nothing's wrong with feeling safe because again, being uprooted from my beginnings, not having a say, not having a voice in what happened to me, I'm familiar with that. But you trick yourselves, like we trick ourselves thinking that we're the creator of our lives and making the path. But the truth is we think we are, but other people are giving you these things and telling you these things and you have to go this way. You have to get married at this age.

Aransas Savas (: 26:59

Mm-hmm.

Meera (: 27:20

Oh my God, you're too old. Why aren't you having kids yet? You only want one, why not two? It's all of these like little things that we get annoyed with, but really and truly we're feeding this normalcy to each other and it doesn't happen. It's never gonna be enough. Like when you had the one kid, what did they say to you? When are you having the second? I just had the one. Like when you're dating. Yeah, but when you're dating, I found somebody, why do I have to get married? Like, why can't we just?

Aransas Savas (: 27:25

Hehehehehehe

Aransas Savas (: 27:33

Mm-hmm, but there's never enough.

Aransas Savas (: 27:42

Right, let me enjoy this one.

Meera (: 27:48

live. Why can't we just live? It's just we don't work that way as humans, I think. And we have to, again, radical thought, put yourself first, but in a way where you really are truly shining and happy from the inside out. And that is freaking hard. So hard.

Aransas Savas (: 27:49

Right?

now.

Aransas Savas (: 28:01

Mm-mm. It's really hard. And I think there were two words you said earlier that I had never heard in the way I heard them when you said them. You said, when I took off. Now, what you were saying, I think, is when you took off of work. But what you were doing is taking off. You were taking flight.

Meera (: 28:14

Eww.

Meera (: 28:22

Mm-hmm.

Meera (: 28:27

Yeah.

Aransas Savas (: 28:28

And I don't know about you, but I spent a long time in one company growing and having lots of influence and impact. And that meant a lot to me. And the company was doing good in the world. And every year I would do the same math. I would say, well, I'm paid pretty well. I'm treated pretty well. I have good impact. I hear other people leaving.

They don't look that happy. Maybe it's not that much better. I'm not happy, but I don't know. What's out there is probably maybe not better. Exactly, I wasn't unhappy, but I wasn't happy. Yep, I'm a master tolerator, have I mentioned? The gift of being a woman. It's especially the gift of being a good girl.

Meera (: 29:09

but you're not unhappy. Right? Right. Exactly. And we're OK with that.

Meera (: 29:19

Are we all? Are we all? Like, yeah. Yeah. Oof. We hate those girls. We are those girls. We are those girls. We're good girls. If I was not a good girl, oh my god.

Aransas Savas (: 29:28

We are those girls. I heard your story. I was like, good girl. Responsibility, optimism, good girl.

Meera (: 29:40

Yeah, so it's funny that you brought up the when I took off. So in my mind, it was a temporary thing, okay? Because that was the safe space for me. That was the stability I needed mentally to tell myself it's only for a little bit of time. If I said I'm quitting the industry, I'm not going back to work, and whatever happens happens, oh my God, I would freak out. But I'm taking some time. See where it leads me.

Aransas Savas (: 29:44

Mm-hmm.

Mm-hmm.

Aransas Savas (: 29:50

sure.

Meera (: 30:07

And I would say to people, I'm just investing in myself. I have my own business. I'm doing all these things. And I did. And I did different things. And I tried to say yes to things that I didn't know. I mean, I've done book narrations. wanna hear my voice continuously outside of my podcast, I've done some book narrations. I've worked with some small businesses in my area to do their social media. I've done a lot of different things. I've coached.

it was all a culmination of various things to find my path. And it turns out my path wasn't so far away from where I was going, but it had to be on my terms, in my own way, with my priorities being respected. And there's a big difference with that.

Aransas Savas (: 30:49

Hmm.

Aransas Savas (: 30:56

Yeah. So it may look similar on the outside, but on the inside it is a whole different ballgame.

Aransas Savas (: 31:23

There's so much choice in that too. And instead of staying on the road that was paved for you, it is this continuous decision to be on the road you're on.

Meera (: 31:25

Yeah.

Meera (: 31:35

If you don't unlock who you are, who's gonna do it for you? Who knows you better? And if you really don't think you know yourself, well, there's a lot that has to happen there. Because you're the only one that can unlock what true well-being, what true happiness is. No one else can do it for you.

Aransas Savas (: 31:44

Mm-hmm.

Aransas Savas (: 31:51

Mm-hmm.

Aransas Savas (: 31:58

Mm-hmm. No. Other people can create courageous space for you to look at you. Meera (32:09.249)

Oh yes.

Meera (: 32:16

Mm-hmm. We deny a lot of what we know about ourselves also. When we talked about not following our instincts, we talk about instincts all the time. Is that a sixth sense? Probably. Most people are in tune with it. Most people ignore it because we don't really go into danger when we ignore it. We have regrets about ignoring it a lot of the times. Oh, I knew that person was a bad person. Oh, I knew I shouldn't have done this.

Aransas Savas (: 32:21

Yeah.

Aransas Savas (: 32:39

Mm.

Meera (: 32:44

But if you actually just listen and damn the repercussions of what your brain is telling you is the right thing to understand and believe versus what your instinct is telling you, you're the only one that's battling with yourself at that point. You're the only one that has a stand up to your judgment for not following your instincts. So why not?

Aransas Savas (: 32:57

Mm.

Aransas Savas (: 33:01

Yes. So all that resistance we feel from the world, right? The time isn't right. The people aren't right. The resources aren't available. Maybe that's us not being willing to really listen to ourselves and to speak our truth.

Meera (: 33:13

Maybe.

Meera (: 33:17

I think for a lot of people, it's easier not to listen to themselves and to listen to others. And you can still have a good life when you listen to others. If you listen to your mom, to my son, listen to everything I say and do everything I tell you, you will be happy. And you probably will be, but will he be fulfilled in the way that he should be? Will he be waking up with a smile on his face, feeling like he did all the things, he's tapped his talent, he's...

Aransas Savas (: 33:25

Mm-hmm.

Aransas Savas (: 33:34

Hehehehe

Meera (: 33:47

waking up every day and joyous and I don't know. I can tell him, go be an accountant and you'll be happy. He'll make money, get a wife, get kids, whatever it is, travel and he would be a measure of happiness. But how am I to say as his mother that I know exactly what's gonna fulfill him? I don't, I can only assume based on my experiences. He is the only one that can tell me, you know what, mom? I know you think I'm so great and I can be an accountant. I don't know, I'm just making that up.

Aransas Savas (: 34:04

And you don't. No.

Meera (: 34:15

No offense to any accountants out there, but I really think I want to play music and that's gonna fulfill me. While Sun be okay with rejection, but go for it. Like I would probably be okay with whatever he decided because if that's his joy, that's his joy, but he has to decide.

Aransas Savas (: 34:33

That's his joy. And it's hard to practice as a parent. My 15-year-old's a gifted writer and musician. She wants to be a full-time professional mermaid when she gradua tes. that is an expression of what fulfills her. What fulfills her is bringing joy to other people.

Aransas Savas (: 35:00

and watching people light up with amazement. Well, that is the lens through which she can now see to do that, so I'm like, oh my, going back again to this idea of center, the rappers are rarely the answer, but the intention and the feeling, that's the secret.

Meera (: 35:23

Yeah. No, it's true.

Aransas Savas (: 35:25

And as I listen to your story, again, I imagine all these women out in the world listening to it, feeling this sense of belief and possibility in their own potential. But I also imagine this little boy of yours going into school and telling other little kids and them believing that they have a sense of choice and possibility. And so as impact led women as people of purpose, I just think it's.

really good every once in a while to just sit with the difference we can make in the world just by being true to ourselves.

Meera (: 36:00

Yeah, and it's not easy, but it can be done. It really can. The more you try to be truthful with yourself, the easier it gets. I will say that. I will say that, but you have to be able to, I don't wanna say not give a damn, but not care as much about other people's opinions of your choices. You just have to be okay that what you decide to do, for whatever decision you make,

Aransas Savas (: 36:02

No.

Aransas Savas (: 36:13

Mm-hmm.

Meera (: 36:31

that people may not agree with it and that is okay because you're okay with it. Like that is, I think, the missing piece. And we don't even realize how much we care about what people think. We could say we don't care, but it's in our actions. It's in our actions.

Aransas Savas (: 36:44

Right. Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. And so we need people like you. We need friends who are courageous. We need sources of support in order to keep bringing us back to that center.

Meera (: 36:56

I know. It's the truth. I mean, you said it earlier. It's, you know, we can help ourselves, but we need those people and we need to be those people. I said I would not be here if my husband didn't support my decision to do what I did. I probably never would have done it if I didn't have him. Right. I had that privilege of having that introspective relationship with myself. That was a privilege. Not everyone can do that.

Aransas Savas (: 37:06

Mm-hmm.

Aransas Savas (: 37:15

Mm-hmm.

Aransas Savas (: 37:22

Mm-hmm.

Meera (: 37:24

But if you can do it in small ways, in small things, it doesn't have to be these big life decisions. It gets easier, you get stronger, you start trusting yourself and it will happen. It just may take a longer time. Thank God for him. Thank God for my son who made me rethink things. I never even thought about retirement until recently. I was like, oh man.

Aransas Savas (: 37:33

Mm-hmm.

Aransas Savas (: 37:47

Mm-hmm.

Meera (: 37:53

Is retirement really 65? Can it be earlier? What am I doing with retirement that I can't do now? That's a question. What was I gonna do? I didn't even know what I was gonna do, but what was I going to do at all this time that I can't do now? I hate to be morbid, but your life could end at any moment. And I wanna be able to say if it ended now or tomorrow, I want people to say, because I care about people, what people think to some degree.

Aransas Savas (: 37:57

Yes.

Right.

Aransas Savas (: 38:13

Yeah.

Aransas Savas (: 38:21

Thank you.

Meera (: 38:21

that she lived her life the way she wanted to and she had a good life and she was happy. And that's it. That's literally how I feel and I'm okay with that.

Aransas Savas (: 38:33

And I'm not sure that's really about what other people think. It sounds like it's about what you think, right? It's about you feeling that way. Yeah, yeah. And they're just a reflection.

Meera (: 38:39

Well, yeah, because I'm at peace with myself. Yeah, true.

Yeah. Aw.

Aransas Savas (: 38:49

Here's to showing up for ourselves in all the big and small ways all day. And I think you make the most important point there is it's not just about, I'm going to leave my career. It's what am I going to do with my hair? What am I going to wear with my, on my body? What am I going to say to people? Who am I going to be in relationship with? What time am I going to go to bed and wake up? We can have personal preferences.

and instincts about all of those things. And I think every time we practice saying yes to our truth in any tiny way, we build the muscles of saying truth in other bigger ways.

Meera (: 39:28

Agreed. 100% co-sign that. It starts off with spend the extra $2 and get the coffee you like and enjoy that coffee every single day. You will never regret having great coffee. do things for you and what fulfills you, and you'll never regret that.

Aransas Savas (: 39:35

Mm.

Aransas Savas (: 39:49

Mm-hmm. That's right. Oh, Mira, what a gift to meet you and talk to you and hear your story. you just give us a little more evidence that.

Aransas Savas (: 40:18

It's not only okay to follow our truth, but that the way to truly take off is through our truth.

Meera (: 40:26

Mm-hmm.

Yes, definitely.

Aransas Savas (: 40:30

Thank you for being here, Mira. Thank you for being you and the world.

Meera (: 40:34

Thank you for having me. This was a wonderful conversation, and I'm so glad I found a kindred spirit.

Aransas Savas (: 40:39

Me too. Uplifters, listen to this one twice. Carry this story in your bones in tiny moments. And when that voice inside of you says, this is the road you should travel, ask yourself if this is the road that brings you back to center.

Meera (: 41:06

I like that.

Aransas Savas (: 41:06

and know that you know the way.

Meera (: 41:10

Yeah, that's a really great way of saying it.