Episode 55
Kathrine Switzer is Still Running Toward Fearlessness
In 1967, a young runner named Kathrine Switzer made history by becoming the first woman to officially enter the Boston Marathon. Her defiant act of fearlessness paved the way for generations of female athletes.
As Kathrine took off down the marathon course, an infuriated official named Jock Semple realized she was a woman and tried to forcibly remove her from the race. In a dramatic scene captured in a series of Pulitzer Prize-winning photographs, Semple lunged at Kathrine and tried to rip off her bib number. Her boyfriend at the time, a burly hammer thrower, shoved Semple away, allowing Kathrine to keep running and ultimately finish the race.
That pivotal moment sparked a lifetime journey for Kathrine to challenge gender barriers and create opportunities for women in running and beyond. From organizing some of the first women-only road races to helping lobby for the women's marathon to be included in the Olympics, her fearless determination left an indelible mark.
Now, 57 years later, Kathrine continues to inspire through her nonprofit 261 Fearless, emboldening women around the world to unleash their inner strength as runners, coaches, and human beings.
In celebration of this Monday's Boston Marathon, where half the runners will be women, here are 5 Uplifting Lessons from Kathrine Switzer that you'll hear in episode 55:
1. Fear can be a catalyst for courage. Kathrine used the opposition and doubters as fuel to propel her forward.
2. Create opportunities where there are none. When women were excluded, Kathrine organized new races and events to open doors.
3. Big dreams take persistence. It has taken decades to make running accessible to women globally, but Kathrine never gave up.
4. Pass the torch to the next generation. At 77, Kathrine is focused on empowering future leaders to carry her mission forward.
5. Fearlessness applies to all aspects of life. Kathrine's spirit extends beyond running into facing fears, pursuing potential, and living boldly.
Connect with Kathrine on Instagram and read more about 261 Fearless and the upcoming Every Women’s Marathon.
After you listen, grab your ticket 🎟️ for Uplifters Live on May 17, where you’ll meet the inspiring Uplifters Ambassadors you’ve heard on our podcast! Learn about this one-day in-person gathering for creative growth and collaboration HERE. Check out all the fun we’re gonna have! ⬇️
Transcript
If you are a runner, you already know this name and this story. But in case Anyone out there doesn't know this story. I'll start with just a little intro to the moment when Kathrine Switzer rose to fame. In 1967, Kathrine Switzer became the first woman to officially enter the Boston Marathon. Now women weren't technically barred from competing and had run the race before without bibs.
saw as protecting the race, [:Her coach then, who was running alongside her, tried to defend Jock off, but was knocked to the ground. And then her boyfriend, who was this bulky hammer thrower, who was running with her, Pushed Semple to the ground, allowing Katherine to keep running and finish the race bib intact. Since that dramatic moment, Katherine has been absolutely instrumental in making running accessible and inviting for women and for helping to bring the joy and empowerment of running to millions worldwide.
g in every room, I owe you a [:Well, thank you.
Kathrine: Thank you so much for having me. What a wonderful story you have. I'd like to hear about your 94 year old. She's pretty amazing, I have to say. We're really proud of her. I must say, she must have been running in my era when she first began.
Aransas: You know, she really didn't start running incredibly until her 60s, when I started running.
Until then, she had been a yogi and a gardener. And so she was always very physically active and very flexible, and then she got the urge to compete. And of course, when you start out at that age on fresh legs. And some of the competition has died down. She got the thrill of winning age group and got really sucked into it.
n really fun. such a gift to [:Kathrine: Well, you know, I have a similar story actually. About 1996, my mother had had some heart issues and the doctor had told her that she needed to walk.
And also, I was over visiting her in Washington. She's reading the Washington Post and she threw the paper down and said, these people are telling us older women that we should always be out walking, but nobody's telling us how. I said, mother, you've seen me for 30 years putting on my shoes and going out the door and running.
And she said, well, what does running have to do with walking? And I said, well, what? And I said, what'd you do? Put your sneakers on and go out there. And she said, what kind of sneakers? Yeah. And all of a sudden my brain clicked. And I said. If my own mother doesn't know this, I've got to write about it. I wrote my first book, Running and Walking for Women, over 40.
d by golly, you know, it was [:And he got all jealous because she was enjoying the neighborhood and he wasn't it was hilarious really but honestly I really learned so much from that moment that if my own mother didn't understand How was the world supposed to get it? So that became a huge part of my crusade and you're right women can start people can start at any age the body never lies And if it feels good, you do it.
is out there trying to, uh, [:Aransas: What a beautiful way of looking at it as something that our bodies crave and need in the same way that they need fruits and vegetables.
Kathrine: Yeah, they do. I don't know if you can tell, but I'm quite congested. I got off a long haul flight. but I said, I've got to go out and I got to get my run in.
because the body needs all those things and nature provides. Aransas: Yes. And isn't that beautiful to have something so therapeutic, so accessible. And free. And free. Yes. I mean, once you get the, the shoes and the sports bra, that's really the essential.
So, bravo to you, the women [:Aransas: So true. So true. I hope it keeps getting better. I'm not 100 percent satisfied on that one. But I think this idea of accessibility, actually, it's so true to even the start of your journey. And I want to go back there a little bit before we go into all of the work you have done. Over the last more than 50 years for women, one of the things I can't get a full picture of is the context of that moment.
What were the headlines saying at the time? Was the world on your side in this moment that you broke through?
Kathrine: It was totally polarizing. You know, I mean, they're either they love me or they hated me. And it was always interesting what the media take is on this. When the picture of the attack went on the newspapers and it was on the front page of it.
as three frames of a girl, a [:So my boyfriend is the hero of the story, not me, okay? And there's polarizing also from the way things were reported, depending on the newspapers. I deserved what I got, or we should take another look at this. Or why don't just women deserve to be on the public street like anybody else? And then the mail that arrived was also extremely polarizing.
You're going to fry in hell. God is going to punish you. This is a terrible thing you have done for women and men and our children. Oh my gosh, it was just poisonous stuff., it was so funny. I ripped it up and threw it away. And my roommates, we, there were bags of mail.
ere wonderful. Like, we were [:they inspired me to realize that while I consider that most of the world is reasonable, I'm an optimist. My father said, it's sort of a joke, but you take a kid into a room full of horseshit and you can tell whether they're an optimist or a pessimist and the pessimist goes, get me out of here.
And the optimist said, there's got My father would always say, that's my daughter,. I used it for inspiration and I used it for the fact that if all these people are so against this, but the women for the most part were so for it. We've got to create.
he Boston area. She knew the [:And then Nina Cusick in New York in Long Island was really good at working with the Athletic Federation and going to all the tedious and boring meetings of rule change and motions. And just, it was so tedious. And I was really good at organizing events and marketing. And therefore you will build the numbers and people will realize how stupid it is not to let women run. I took the idea further. And you might recall this in history that in 1972, we organized the first ever women's only road race.
was called the mini marathon [:So why don't we have a shorter race? And Fred Lebow came up with the idea of making it a mini marathon and one loop around Central Park, which was totally manageable and interesting as 72 women showed up. It was amazing. It was amazing because I mean, 70 women then is like 70, 000 now or 7, 000 anyway. It was a big success.
n your field hockey team and [:And he gave me that opportunity. And Arnie Briggs, my first coach at Syracuse University, gave me that opportunity by encouraging me to run distance and telling me about the marathon.
Aransas: We need somebody to say, I believe in you. You can do this. This is possible.
Kathrine: When I was training for that first Boston Marathon, my coach didn't want me to do it because he didn't believe a woman could do it. Even though he believed in me,he said, no Dame ever ran no marathon. I tried to tell him that Roberta Gibb had run the Boston Marathon the year before.
miles. When we were [:And then we know we've got it in the bag. And he said, can you run another five miles? And I said, sure. Can you, I feel great. And he goes, anyway, the last mile he was gone. Eyes were crossed weaving all over the road. And when we finished, I flung my arms around him. I said, we did it. We did it. We're going to Boston. what was going through your mind when Jock lunged at you?
d. See, I didn't know he was [:And when you're out training. You can hear a dog behind you sometimes before he lunges, right? You hear the claws on the pavement. Yeah. And you turn. And that's exactly what I heard. I said, this, you know, it's like such a foreign sound. I quickly turned. And there he was. And then he's, uh, this looming monster.
And I looked right in his face. And he just screamed at me. He said, get the hell out of my race. And give me those numbers. I was just terrified, really, because he grabbed me and he kept trying to rip my numbers off of me. I didn't want what's going on. So the first reaction was quite terrifying. And then it was trying to get away from him.
ng. I've never been close to [:And I thought, Oh my God, we're going to be in really big trouble because Tom is a hotheaded guy and we've killed this guy. We're going to go to jail. So immediately now I'm feeling sorry for him. My coach Arnie was aghast as well and he just screamed run like hell. And then we just took off down the street, flying past the press truck who were trying to, you know, get alongside of us and berate me and what are you trying to prove and when are you going to quit?
would have left him. And of [:Aransas: Poor Tom.
Kathrine: He said, I'm going to run the Boston Marathon, too. And I said, Tom, you know, you weigh 235 pounds, you're a really good athlete. But I said, you've done no training. And he said, if a girl can do it, I can do it.
Aransas: Is that so, Tom?
Kathrine: Well, he came in handy, Aransas: Yes, quite literally. So, what was going through your head now as you got further into the race? I've heard you say that you started to make peace with Jock and see him as a spark that lit a fire in you.
Kathrine: Yes. I was angry with him up until about 21 miles.
way of doing that I felt is [:And when I finished in four hours and 20 minutes, he indeed, the next day at a press conference said, Four hours, 20 minutes. I could have walked it that fast. Well, all that did was increase my resolve to become a better athlete. I improved to two hours and 51 minutes, and it was so exciting to me. It took me quite a long time, what, three years.
It was so exciting for me to see my body, which I always felt was kind of an average athlete body, not a good athlete, become a good athlete, get a world ranking. It was such a thrill. And I'm constantly, constantly amazed by the capacity of human achievement. We got together, us women, to organize both legislation and create events.
only races and went to Avon [:So therefore gave women an opportunity to earn an income when at the time of the, when it was founded at the turn of the century, women were not allowed jobs. They weren't allowed to go out and get a wage, but they could sell the little cosmetics to their friends, right.. So I put all these ideas together And I took it to them as an experiment in marketing, you know, saying that if they organized a bunch of races with me, helping them with this plan around the world, cause they're a big multinational company, 125 countries, they could increase the international participation.
tion, we can get the women's [:And the marathon, no way. It's going to take you till 2012 to make that happen. Avon loved the proposal and they hired me. Now, I only really did it as an experiment. I had no idea that they would offer me a job.
So once I got in the door, I'm a real, give me this much and I'll kick it open. I just hammered them on this race. I said, let me do just one race. Let me just do one race. I'll show you what kind of publicity we can get.
ayout in Sports Illustrated. [:We eventually put on races in 27 countries, 400 races for over a million women. And we had the data to show the International Olympic Committee that women not only had the performances, but they had the ability, the international representation to warrant inclusion in the Olympic Games.
tries and five continents. In:This was the physical equivalent. Aransas: That's incredible. And it all started because of this really harrowing moment. Absolutely. you had all these people yelling at you. They said, don't start.
And then they said, stop. And you said, I'm going to keep going. And I think so often in life, we can hear those voices that say stop or don't start. And one of two things happens. We either say, I'm going to keep going and I'm going to use your resistance as my fuel or we say, you're right, I'm going to stop.
trained for endurance, we're [:Kathrine: My bib number, 261, from the Boston Marathon.
Suddenly, people began writing to me and saying, that number, 261, makes me feel fearless. And they were putting it on their back in their first marathon, sometimes they would ink it on their wrist, and they'd say, it gives me courage. And I was saying, what does this mean?
earless. So I was at a press [:And I said, yeah, but I said, I'm not going to reach the women I want to reach And she said, well, what women you talk about? I said, Mideast, We're not going to reach them. She said, you're absolutely wrong. She said, Those women would rally for this. And I said, they can't, they're not even going to hear about it.
about it. She said, they're [:She and I became very good friends. She said, look, what we do is we form a nonprofit. And we'll do a series of groups in a safe space, nonjudgmental, nothing to do with competition, but let's get women out the door. You go, you take them by the hand, and you say, come on, just go out and walk with me.
. We train women to become a [:I'm working on being philosophical about it, about handing it off to this next generation.
Aransas: And I will challenge your belief there a bit to say, of course, first of all, I hope you have many, many, many more years of life and that this grows exponentially and. We haven't even seen the end of what you did getting us into Boston.
eminder that every one of us [:I love that you call your organization 261 Fearless because to me it is an acknowledgement not that we are doing this without fear. Exactly. But that we're doing it in spite of fear. Exactly. what are some of the doors maybe that we're not seeing that we need to poke our little toes in like you did and then kick them the heck open?
Kathrine: I worry about the politics, okay? So you know, there are pictures of women in Afghanistan in, when? The early 80s? They're out shopping. Okay. They haven't been completely shuttered and closeted and restricted.
total reversion of what I am [:Okay. That's okay with me. You go be a housewife. But don't criticize those of us who really want to get our daughters into grad school and to get a job and to be able to succeed and to be a CEO. I find the capacity for human achievement so amazing that anyone wouldn't want to go and grab it, you know? Yeah.
Aransas: So we've talked a lot about you as a runner, you were known as a runner, and yet my suspicion is This fearlessness is core to who you are.
sness had on who Kathrine is [:Kathrine: there's so many ways when I find myself totally incapable, for instance, cleaning up my mess. You should see the books that are downstairs and covered with dust and still in boxes and the memorabilia and the notes and the historical documents that got to be annotated.
Syracuse University wants my papers, but they want them annotated and it's fair enough too. But I totally am incapable of doing that because that's something in the past So that makes me fearful. I fall in bed at night and I'm thinking, Oh, You know what, you know, if I don't clean that stuff up and get it annotated, you know, somebody's going to come in here and dump it in a dumpster.
I doubt that. Would you like to
Aransas: come up and help me? Yes, I would. Sign me up. Kathrine: I
tant work that you're doing. [:Kathrine: I just have this kind of fear, okay, if I have a fear, I'm kind of running out of time.
Okay. In the last three years, I've had some physical setbacks, which were mostly my fault, I must say. But the fact is, is that I'm no longer bulletproof. Aransas: What is that teaching you?
Kathrine: Well, it's teaching me, first of all, to quit being so ridiculously optimistic and adventuresome.
You know, this series of catastrophes happened when I was doing a fundraiser. My girlfriend of mine said that she was going to swim across a frozen lake, break the ice and swim across it on New Year's Day if she could raise 1, 000 for 261 Fearless. I said, that's not enough money for doing that. You could get really frostbitten or whatever.
day. So I said, I'm going to [:If something happens. And I said, what could happen? And just, just jump off the board. I go in the water. Well, I jumped off the board. And in fact, the tide was out. There was plenty of water. There was plenty of water, but it made it like a four story building rather than the three story building. And I went into the water and landed on my back, broke my back in two places, broke four ribs and broke my sternum.
ight? So if you were an over [:Kathrine: I'll see you there. I'm delighted to say that my last mini 10k, which was last year. I ran, what, 67 minutes. I was so excited, but now I'm down to 57 minutes. Amazing! So, I've gotten my mojo back, I'll look forward to seeing you.
e signed up this year to run [:So it's even more special that I get to talk to you and see you there. Uplifters, thank you for listening. I'll see all of you on May 17 at Caveat for Uplifters Live. Kathrine, thank you for being here. Thank you for all you've done for the running community and for women in general. Thank you for listening to the Uplifters podcast.
